No I’m not catastrophising.
The world is slowly lurching towards a fully fascist led America, India, Hungary, Russia, Netherlands, Germany, Italy and Argentina.
Instead people are either ignorant or blaming “wokeism”* for their problems.
I have no clue what to do and this is literally a car crash in slow motion.
I’m despondent because I’m going to be crushed under the boot when the time comes and my morals get in the way of my survival instinct.
Humans are repeating the mistakes of the past. It’s just so anxiety inducing.
*Woke is a useless term promulgated by fascists to dog whistle the things they really want to hate - feminism, socialism, LGBTQIA+, immigration, brown/black people, equality and diversity.
Because all the vets have died off.
Most of the generation that saw that war have died, not just the vets. The living memory of world war and fascism is gone.
The one thing the Nazis did right was their propaganda. Even at our day, it succeeds in poisoning the impressionables.
Their submarines were pretty good. But then the Navy was some of the least infected parts of their regime so that tracks. They made good tanks and planes before Hitler got involved and those became prestige projects instead of real projects. (Thinking Pz3 and BF109 early)
But yeah you’ve got to really pick the carcass apart to find stuff. Turns out being a meth addled extremist surrounded by other meth addled extremists isn’t a great way to run a country.
Well then the good thing is they still have meth.
Anger (trauma…anxiety… the whole knot) comes first. Then the propaganda sells you an efficient, socially accepted (well, to the right society) form of rationalization and expression. IE a story and lifestyle to process the emotions.
Say what you will about the ism, but the emotions must be processed. One way or another.
My point is, nazi is a shoe. The impressionable traumatized dude is the foot looking for a shoe.
I hate to say this but I’ve honestly just gotten used to the idea at this point. I’ve been watching the people around me howling in support of fascism since about 2015 now and the more egregious these politicians crimes become the louder these idiots seem to howl for them. It’s been going so long that it’s just part of the background noise of day to day life now, and I’m tired of caring anymore. It’s fucking depressing.
How can we convince people now is the time to act? What more information do we need? I think most people are clinging to the idea everything is business as usual. As long as they can keep the lights on they wouldn’t want to upset the stability they’ve managed to make for themselves.
As a Russian who’s been thinking about what could’ve been done about Putin’s many moves towards authoritarianism, I say this: I don’t know. I dint think anyone knows either.
indsight is 20/20, so good luck trying to convince people to act now, before the far and distant future is here; it’s probably part of our nature to not be that much concerned with the long-term, as it’s the short- to mid-term that keeps us alive, i.e. fed, sheltered, hopefully healthy etc.
At this point, it feels like history is indeed very cyclical, at least society is, and now anyone left of outright fascism seems to be in minority, with many others either failing or refusing to recognise what’s likely coming. I don’t think it’s new, either - I’m sure people of our ages had things to compare their situation to during the Nazis’ rise to power and subsequent events, just like we look back to their times and wonder how in the world could we possibly let that happen.
It’s probably best to vote and to protest and to be politically active and all that, before the right-wing or some other authoritarian group manages to manipulate its way into your government, local or higher, and start doing all it can to make you not even think of voting or protesting or being politically active. The caveat is you just don’t have any guarantees that any of that is going to work.
What’s even more important to remember is the fact that we cannot come up with some universal solution that’s going to always work the best way possible in every political and economical and social circumstance. This is what makes recording history and experience so important - it will allow us and those that will be after us to analyse the multitudes of factors and tendencies that lead to things and hopefully figure out reliable and effective and predictable mechanisms for society to function and prosper in mutual respect, egalitarianism, support, etc.
My last take is probably a little controversial: I think we shouldn’t ostracise people we see as fascist or right-wing or authoritarian, etc., but rather be welcoming and supporting, giving them respect, community and opportunity to speak and be listened to with kindness and understanding; many turn to violent and inhumane ideologies because, well, they don’t value themselves, feel threatened, humiliated, afraid, or something along these lines. It doesn’t have to be true, because it’s about how people feel, and we must work with how people feel and influence that on emotional level so they feel like they being in a group that’s based on being “anti-woke” or just “anti-” something - that’s a dead end; they should feel like they belong to groups that envision future and prosperity, where people know they can be trusted and can trust, where they can respect and be respected. You may not like it, but you have to understand that the human psyche can be very flexible and eventually turn a person you could easily turn into a human-loving ally into a bloodthirsty fascist just because they couldn’t find their place anywhere else, so instead they’re easily picked up by a group that manipulates confused and lost people into a sense of community and belonging.
Fascism has to be the unappealing option for them, and that requires a mind healthy from trauma and loneliness, the lack of that feeling like you’ve been played and robbed of something you own - like some great historical period the mouthpieces promise to get you back into if you yell at teenage girls for wearing bright-colored hair and rainbow pins.
I agree with your controversial take, however it’s important to note that a lot of this fascist rhetoric relies on misinformation which is spread far quicker and further than the truth. And the neofascism that has taken hold is very in-group oriented (i.e. the concepts that the in group is by definition morally virtuous and thus can do no real harm, whereas the out-group is the opposite) which is difficult to break down with logic and rhetoric. That’s not to say it can’t be done, but in terms of conversion (purely as a metric, i don’t mean to be oberly reductionist) it will always be one step forward three back. And if they people don’t approach a conversation in good faith it can be downright impossible to get them to even fathom a differing perspective. What I’m saying is that the new breed of fascists rely solely on dogma and groupthink, and have been trained to reject any rebuttal or outside perspective. They took what the old fascists did well and optimized it and trained people in it for the past 70+ years.
Yes, fully agree, we’re living in post apocalypse times :( Climate crisis will cause more casualties, and the rising fascism will do so as well. There’s usual housing crisis, and the hyped A.I. as well among others.
In your list of countries you can add Belgium as well. In fact today it is hard to think of a country in Europe which has shown zero far right or fascism sentiments nowadays. It is difficult to focus on positive things but things like solidarity, keeping in touch with like minded people, de-growth, D.I.Y. and de-googling can help.
I think it sucks when you are forced to save the environment but the rich don’t have to change their lifestyle at all. They should be the first to have to change since they affect the environment a lot more.
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Guillotine is a solution. What aazes me is that they’re living like it should be the only solution.
How is Argentina fascist? The president is just trying to exterminate inflation
Among other things, the “anarcho-capitalist” is privatizing state companies, okay, that tracks, but it’s also something the Nazis did, and banning abortion and giving security forces more power.
Wait a minute, banning abortion and giving cops more power?
That’s not something anarcho-capitalism supports!
It’s almost like, like every other ancap who gets power, he’s just a lying fascist!
https://foreignpolicy.com/2023/12/09/javier-milei-is-the-worlds-latest-wannabe-fascist/
Sounds like: latin america bad ಠ_ಠ
I can see how a liar would pretend to believe that.
Anything I have learned from history classes is that this cycle of fascism/dictatorship and democracy has always been going on, people are dumb -> they choose fascists -> fascist gonna fasc -> ppl get fed up -> uprising/protests -> government overthrown after tons of bloodshed -> some sort of constitutional bind on rulers/elections -> some peace -> dumb ppl forget everything and chose fascists again -> repeat
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The human race we have an insane ability to forget history
You need history classes that cover more than the little fart of time known as the 20th century.
Well I only studied the history part which was mandatory in my school, so it was naturally not very in-depth or far back, only standard topics like the World wars, french and russian revolutions etc
I think you forgot the part where capitalism makes peoples life worse and worse, while at the same time conservative media blames the left for it, even if they are the cause.
Because in the End people dont vote for fascists because its funny, but because they believe they can get them out of a shitty situation (Fascism doesnt do that obviously, but people get blinded by propaganda).
We wouldnt have this issue today if politicians werent all neoliberal and actually cared about poor people.
All we have to do is unite. There’s more of us than them. And we don’t even have to protest or leave our homes. They all bow down to the mighty dollar, all we have to do is plan not to buy from ‘company A’ unless they ‘insert world fixing demand that they’re currently doing the opposite of’ ’ knock them down one by one. We could even pool together a dollar or two each, that’s all we’d need if we got enough people together and buy ourselves our very own Politician!! We may even be able to buy them all back… That’s probably pipe dreams. We need to make Poole’s union.
We have never successfully done that. Nestle is still out there doing their stuff
May i present to you:
the antifacist handbook, free to download/read (in different formats like pdf/epub/html/plaintext):
https://theanarchistlibrary.org/library/mark-bray-antifa-the-antifascist-handbook
Thanks for this, reading now.
I’ve also been busy reading the history of the rise of the Nazi party particularly the SA.
It’s scary (scary is not a strong enough word for the combined emotions of frustration, anger, fear, anxiety) how close current USA events are replicating the original rise of Nazi Germany.
It’s happening in France too. Are the fascists roaming the streets to beat leftists and Arabs in your country too?
Are the fascists roaming the streets to beat leftists and Arabs in your country too?
Only in the east and rural areas. So far.
Even current German events are replicating the rise of Nazi Germany. But many people are too blind to see…
Yeah, it’s so sad. Before inflation and all the other shit, nobody cared about fascist, but now they’re like
“Oh hey, that are so easy solutions to my severe Problems, I don’t care if they discriminate a minority or a group of people. Let’s vote them!”
Just to realize that they would change nothing - they will make it worser - and install slowly but surely their fucking pervert dictatorship.
to my severe problems
You mean the problems the fascist just made up and actually aren’t a really problem
It worries me too and I’ve been thinking a lot about margaritas, I’ve been sober for four years so its troubling thoughts of alcohol are creeping back in. I don’t know what else to say. Need a hug?
Need a hug?
Wish I could give one
Are you going to the meetings?
What fucking meetings? For my alcoholism or for my depression about the future?
…If there’s any for the latter can I get a hookup?
I think this is the meeting.
Hi everybody, my name is Zink @programming.dev and I am a democracyholic.
Hi Zink
https://aa-intergroup.org/meetings/
On line AA meetings. 24/7. The only requirement to go to AA is a desire to stay stopped. If you think your depression is going to make you drink, come talk about it.
SMART Recovery is a non-Christian substance abuse support group. Though it can be difficult to find an in-person meeting because AA is so prevalent.
I’m in NA meetings on discord. There’s also a big God involved but just try to look besides that. They’re open ans very welcome to anyone that wants to stop
AA is a Christian support group, if you don’t believe in their God they won’t help you.
If you look at the site I provided, you’ll see that they have plenty of atheist/agnostic meetings [labelled ‘secular.’]
They also have a lot of LGBTQ+ meetings, as well as men only and women only options.
AA suggests people try to find a Higher Power of their own understanding.
These are religious meetings for addicts and alcoholics. The atheist and agnostic meetings are well-meaning but they talk about gods even more than at the non-secular meetings.
I am however delighted it works for you.
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Yes it literally is. Or at the very least you have to “submit yourself to a higher power”
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That’s one of the steps yeah. And it’s recommended to follow all steps but nobody is forcing you. You can just go as you want and try to follow the other ones as much as possible. Also a higher power could mean different things if you’re creative enough.
The word “fascist” has truly lost its meaning. Please stop using this word if you don’t understand the historical context behind it.
“Fascism (/ˈfæʃɪzəm/ FASH-iz-əm) is a far-right, authoritarian, ultranationalist political ideology and movement, characterized by a dictatorial leader, centralized autocracy, militarism, forcible suppression of opposition, belief in a natural social hierarchy, subordination of individual interests for the perceived good of the nation or race, and strong regimentation of society and the economy.” Wikipedia
Which word would you employ to address those seeking power through the scapegoating and targeted discrimination of minorities and vulnerable populations?
They are using not just the same rhetorical frames as the Nazis, they are often using the same exact phrases and propaganda techniques, just in social media. They are seeking/achieving autocratic rule. I don’t think they are winning the world on the whole, but they are growing stronger… They are fascist movements.
Fascism is on the rise. Ignoring it doesn’t make you look smarter.
My guy, Italian politicians literally publicly idolize the good ol’ days of Mussolini, and talk about Mussolini in a positive light, I think that’s worthy of the title fascist since they’re praising the guy who CREATED FASCISM. The current PM is just a fascist.
And Putin, Orbán, Modi, the AfD are incredibly undeniably fascist. Or at the very least Modi and Orbán are fascist-adjacent (Modi is a sort of Nazi but for Hindus instead of Germans).
I don’t know enough about Dutch politics/politicians to speak of it. But afaik they’re going down a similar path as Germany, Sweden, etc. but even more pronounced. Argentina I don’t know if the word “fascist” is accurate at all but the new president is certainly very far-right.
And in the US Republicans are descending towards fascism, they’ve already taken many of our rights and are in the process of taking more fundamental rights, the things the most popular Republicans publicly preach about and have like half the country’s support over is sickening. The only reason we’re not balls deep into stripping away the rights of anyone who doesn’t fit into the majority categories (christian, white, straight/cis, male) is because Democrats exist (even though elected Democrats just play the “moderate Republican” and are complicit in the current state of the country).
Downvoted, i think OP understands very well the historical context of the word.
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Is that the tldr? I didn’t read it.
What do you mean by this? Are you talking about OP’s argument? I don’t get it.
Slowly?
Even better is watching liberals ignore it and ban everyone who tells them to arm up to defend themselves. This is seen as “advocating violence” because they think that fascists will be nice to them if they are nice to fascists.
Yeah, well, the dichotomy exists because of the inability of the average human to appreciate nuance. No surprise it’s become a fucking shitshow.
It’s interesting watching idiots like you thinking fascists will respect you for owning guns.
It’s far more likely they’ll murder you and your entire family in your own home for being perceived as a threat to their fascism.
It’s the ones who won’t fight back that survive.
Looks like we found one of the first targets
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Where did I apologize?
My knowledge and ability to apply logic to a future scenario seems to have confused you as approving future scenario.
Based on this new knowledge, I can predict there is a 50/50 chance the fascists will successfully recruit you as a useful fool.
Morons are easy to brainwash.
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Moving that prediction up to 80/20 in favor. Best you order yourself a pair of jackboots.
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This isn’t even a car crash brother it’s like watching 8 separate trains collide
nice username
Let’s start with this: Can you do anything personally to save the world? I’m not talking incremental personal improvement rainbows and butterflies horseshit, I’m saying can you personally do anything to stop what is clearly a catastrophic trajectory?
If you can, do it. If you can’t, which I believe nobody can at this point, it’s time to stop worrying and live the life you have left.
Spend more time outside, learn to paint acrylics, go get some pussy.
Why torture yourself and live in misery? Why allow all the evil people trying to terrorize you to succeed? Fuck that noise.
Read this, it’ll help: https://classics.mit.edu/Epictetus/epicench.html
This is really bad advice, you sound like a 15 y/o.
Ahh yes. The better advice is to protest and waste time. 😂
Behold, the unconscious class, pontificating about inner peace and enlightenment from their ivory tower of unearned privilege and willful ignorance
Its not about ignorance but being aware. Realising you can’t change the external situation so you change what you can control.
So you instead choose silent complicity with injustice and evil? I can’t change geopolitics sure, but at the very least you can bear witness and raise your voice to make others aware. And then somebody else who sees that issue, might have the power to change something.
If we all said “Damn that sucks for George Floyd, but police unions and politicians are big and scawy institutions- let’s do absolutely fucking nothing and go on with our lives” that is moral bankruptcy.
Stop digging and admit you don’t care about others dude, there’s no good way out of this hole you built
Right now. I no longer have the energy to do what you say. The only thing I CAN do as individual is focus on my self.
I care about others, I also donate to charities, i care about.
Idk what you mean by “hole i built”, it’s not that serious as you are taking it to be.
I can’t change your opinion about me (if you think, I’m evil) no matter how much I scream and yell. Everyone else sticks to their own positions in life, you and I are no different. It’s hard to change someone else or make a difference without influence/power.
That’s why its better to try and spend energy and time to create the life you want to live. Maybe then something can change and you may have the power to influence a small community/people.
Think globally, act locally
I don’t think you’re evil, but this attitude is part of the problem that enables terrible people to get away with horrific acts. “Why didn’t the Germans stop the holocaust?” can be explained a lot of ways, but complicity and silence feature throughout the answers, along with the ghouls who encouraged it
For a while I did exactly as you are doing. I was super involved in tracking and witnessing police abuses and misconduct, watching the drip-drip-drip while the country sat idle - and you’re right, it’s super depressing to see an obvious issue and be unable to change it. I did step away for a while when it got overwhelming, but me ignoring a problem, simply permits those abuses to continue without criticism or exposure.
I have the social, geographic and ethnic privilege to not be routinely affected negatively by the issues in the world, but I refuse to turn that to mute complicity
You are 100% correct. But…
For me, I don’t have the time to think globally.
I’m an 18 year old Asian male teenager - Middle Class Family.
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I need to make money - help my parents financially hoping to retire them earlier. These are the closest people I can help. My loved ones
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I have to stay in shape, fit and healthy (for the work I’m in)
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Trying to work on my business for passive income.
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Dealing with personal stress, issues and finances. (I’m in physcotherapy)
Do you still think as an individual, I have enough energy left to think about stuff that won’t help me and my family.
You say that you used to think like me. That does not mean you’re better or worse than me. It just means our priorities as individuals are different.
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“You can’t do anything to personally fix this, so you might as well not worry about it”
I fucking hate this mindset. This mindset is the reason we are in this position. We can’t just sit idly by and silently watch the right implement fascist policy and say “well, they were gonna try anyways, nothing we can do I guess”.
Go do something then, dumbass. Bc you won’t.
How do you expect to change someone else/world when you can’t even change yourself?
If I got through the end of the world in 2012 I can get through this
Joke? Some people say that the Mayans were right and the world did end in 2012; it’s just that it takes a long time for a system this big to fully stop functioning
That still doesn’t make sense. The world didn’t end in 2016. We are still here.
Nothing magical happened in 2016 that hasn’t been happening for the last 50 years. It’s a slow grind to the bottom.
You could argue that 2008 was the end of the world or 2001. Both events has led the economic strife you’re seeing today which is really what collapse looks like. Both those events supersede anything that happened in 2016.
If anything this is a self fulfilling prophecy and nothing to do with Mayans. It’s a silly argument to make.
Edit: the Mayan calendar ended 2012. Not 2016. I can’t remember anything special happening in 2012.
I wrote 2016; meant to write 2012. Ooops
Harambe died in 2016, marking the real end of the world
That’s is when things got extra fucked.
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