Moscow says it will keep pushing its offensive in Ukraine, though NATO doubts Russia has the resources to make a significant breakthrough.

NATO’s top military officer has said Russia’s armed forces are incapable of any major advance.

“The Russians don’t have the numbers necessary to do a strategic breakthrough,” NATO’s Supreme Allied Commander Europe Christopher Cavoli told reporters on Thursday.

“More to the point, they don’t have the skill and the capability to do it; to operate at the scale necessary to exploit any breakthrough to strategic advantage,” the general said.

  • Amoxtli@thelemmy.club
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    7 months ago

    I dont think its unreasonable to assume that the Russian military command genuinely believed the they were a lot stronger than they actually were when this started. Just based on what news I’ve been following, it seems like its very common for Russian officers to lie to their superiors about how strong their units are for the sake of looking good.

    Russia isn’t part of NATO. Why is NATO contradicting itself with a narrative that Putin is out to conquer Europe, bring back the USSR, and claim here, it is too weak to do so on this front?

    • mean_bean279@lemmy.world
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      7 months ago

      Last time I checked, Ukraine was in fact part of Europe. It’s a bit strange, I know. So with that, maybe attacking Ukraine (again, part of Europe) is attacking Europe. Oh, and that answer should answer your whole “and is trying to bring back the USSR” piece of your question. If you’re gonna simp for Putin at least just own up to an unproved attack and a land grab, no need to dance around like it makes you morally superior.

      • Amoxtli@thelemmy.club
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        7 months ago

        Paying attention to the quote I have of your statement

        I dont think its unreasonable to assume that the Russian military command genuinely believed the they were a lot stronger than they actually were when this started. Just based on what news I’ve been following, it seems like its very common for Russian officers to lie to their superiors about how strong their units are for the sake of looking good.

        • mean_bean279@lemmy.world
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          7 months ago

          Bad news, I’m not the person you’re quoting. I’m assuming your native tongue is Russian. Because you’re either very pro-Russia, or your tongue is at least in Putin’s asshole.

        • nahuse@sh.itjust.works
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          7 months ago

          Intelligence about state capabilities come, first and foremost, from the state itself.

          What are you confused about here? That foreign intelligence services believed Russian assessments of its own capabilities?

          Yes, the Russian grossly overestimated their capabilities. Yes, many foreign analysts agreed that the Russian military was powerful.

          This is ended up being less the case. But that doesn’t mean the Russian military isn’t dangerous or is completely incompetent and incapable of change.

          What’s your point?

          • fuckingkangaroos@lemm.ee
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            7 months ago

            Probably better not to waste your time “debating” them, their goal is only to spread misinformation, and they won’t argue in good faith.

            Better to just tag them as “shill,” downvote, and move on.

            • NOT_RICK@lemmy.world
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              7 months ago

              I like to provide links that prove when people are spouting bullshit so anyone who is less informed that stumbles upon the argument can see how blatantly wrong they are. I notice this guy got awful quiet once I proved Russian state media says insane threatening shit on the regular.

              • fuckingkangaroos@lemm.ee
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                7 months ago

                I’m sure that’s helpful. It’s interesting to think that while the Kremlin’s disinformation campaigns do trick a lot of people, they also end up educating a lot of people.

            • nahuse@sh.itjust.works
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              7 months ago

              I respectfully disagree.

              I take part in conversations not for their benefit, necessarily, but observers’ benefit. And one of the most effective ways of fighting propaganda is to shine a light on it.

              If you just delete every dissenting worldview without engaging, then it runs the risk of making the other positions more legitimate to others watching but not engaging, or gives fodder to the ideas that “we” in the more open parts of the world are just as bad as authoritarians at silencing dissent, which isn’t usually true.

              I’d agree if the other poster was only spamming ad hom attacks all over, but there’s enough logic laced in there that I find it’s worth discussing and trying to understand, if only to better understand where Russian disinformation is.

    • gsfraley@lemmy.world
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      7 months ago

      Because Putin trying and failing still results in genocide and millions dead, ya goof. A pyrrhic victory for the people trying to defend their home and defend their neighbors and loved ones is a helluva lot worse than if Russia never fucked with them in the first place.

    • NOT_RICK@lemmy.world
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      7 months ago

      It’s possible to have aspirations beyond what your current capabilities are. Look at Benito Mussolini’s entire military history. Russian state media regularly makes claims that they will reconquer the Baltics and Poland. They even said they would nuke the North Sea to destroy Britain with a tidal wave. Are we supposed to just ignore what they say?

      • Amoxtli@thelemmy.club
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        7 months ago

        It’s possible to have aspirations beyond what your current capabilities are. Look at Benito Mussolini’s entire military history. Russian state media regularly makes claims that they will reconquer the Baltics and Poland. They even said they would nuke the North Sea to destroy Britain with a tidal wave. Are we supposed to just ignore what they say?

        I am going to make a bet you can’t back up your statements. NATO is too stupid to figure out the military strength of Russia and takes their word for it, instead?

    • mephiska@kbin.run
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      7 months ago

      What their actions and intentions have been, and what they are actually capable of, are two different things. There is nothing contradictory here.

    • Num10ck@lemmy.world
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      7 months ago

      geography. The current borders of Russia dont have enough natural barriers to secure from land invasion with their troop level. if they could expand to reach more natural barriers then they can defend the remaining barriers. this strategy hasnt changed in ages. its becoming more obvious that russia cant achieve this with what they currently have on their own. if say north korea and/or china and others pitch in, the math changes.

    • assassin_aragorn@lemmy.world
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      7 months ago

      Because Russia has been gradually conquering territory, not all at once. They create puppet states and take over land, then regroup and rebuild before attacking again. There’s a clear pattern of this with Georgia, Crimea, and now the whole of Ukraine. Each time prior, the international community wagged its finger and slapped sanctions. It’s generally accepted now that enough is enough, and it ends here.

      It certainly doesn’t help either that Russia has been funding far right parties throughout the West who try to lift sanctions against Russia.