I know this, you know this. But there’s things called hedged leveraging and acceptable loss.
I think that they understand that their time is valuable, they don’t want to deal with this shit and my service provides them more value than the amount of money they give me.
This is important.
What are my community ambitions with these instances? Honestly, none.
So why should someone trust you? You’re not emotionally involved nor committed.
I still stand by the idea that having content mirrored from reddit is better than having no content at all
So an RSS feed? Why does anyone need you then?
The first plan is to let anyone create communities on fediverser-enabled instances (even if they don’t have an account there)
Bad idea.
Community Ambassadors
Yes, you need people who are personally invested in order to build local and wider Fediverse communities.
I agree with you so much that I don’t even understand where this criticism is coming from. I’ve written multipleblogposts arguing for a less server-centered approach to these open social media platforms, to the point that starting to drop “Fediverse” from my vocabulary and calling it “Open Social Web”.
You did a post and someone said, “you know you’re describing nostr” and that made me chuckle
I don’t even understand where this criticism is coming from.
It’s not personal criticism, it’s more observation and clash of ideals. I would prefer to see 20 small but equally active communities about baking, over one on the biggest instance. I wholeheartedly believe people need to get used to traveling around the Fediverse but also building up the communities they’re a member of.
I did. I also wrote to the mods of /r/nba and /r/nfl, because I also created instances for that. I got zero responses. The lesson I learned here: with very few exceptions, the mods of really popular subreddits are too high on their power-trip and do not want to risk anything by moving out.
Not the Reddit moderators, the Lemmy World ones.
So…
what’s the benefit? What does anyone get that they can’t get for free elsewhere?
Hi, my name is Raphael. My passions are a decentralized open social web and web administration. Luckily, these two come together beautifully. It’s because they’re such a marriage made in heaven that I am able to offer the services I can. If you want to host Fediverse services without any of the hassle that comes with such an endeavor, get in touch or if you’re simply someone that wants a guarantee that your instance won’t disappear, get in touch.
I’m getting the feeling that you are talking about things that more specific to Fediverser (the tools to help migration from Reddit to Lemmy, which is mostly an open source project) than Communick (which is a professional hosting service). But anyway.
You’re not emotionally involved nor committed.
My email provider is not “emotionally involved or committed” to my emails. Yet, I still trust them they will do their best to keep me using their services.
So an RSS feed?
An RSS feed does not provide the possibility to interact with the post. There were a good number of conversations between Lemmy users that got started off a mirrored Reddit post.
(Letting users create communities on topic-instances) Bad idea.
Why?
“you know you’re describing nostr”
Which is a myopic take. Nostr has a fundamental issue around identity management. They went too far to the other direction in the decentralization spectrum and will never be able to reach mainstream appeal. The only companies that are going to support it are (unsurprisingly) the ones that are owned or financed by Jack.
What I am proposing is still based around ActivityPub and doesn’t throw the baby with the bathwater. Much like identity should not be coupled with the server running it, identity should not be coupled with your cryptographic keys.
I would prefer to see 20 small but equally active communities about baking, over one on the biggest instance.
What you “prefer” has little to do with what people want. I agree that we should strive to spread around different instances, but what is the benefit of having groups with similar interests spread around different communities? If these “similar interests” turn out to not be so similar after all, sure then they can and should branch out. But I don’t understand what is the value of favoring an explosion of content spread around. Content discovery is already the biggest challenge in the Fediverse, by fragmenting more than needed we end up with a bunch of people just yelling in their rooms to themselves.
Not the Reddit moderators, the Lemmy World ones.
That’s a given. I also promoted it on New Communities. I also made posts announcing the instances. I also asked people here to join. I’m still posting whatever content I think is relevant to these spaces.
My email provider is not “emotionally involved or committed” to my emails. Yet, I still trust them they will do their best to keep me using their services.
Isn’t that why we have a duopoly when it comes to email providers? The thing with the Fediverse is that we’re trying to change the culture of how people think and use the Internet. We need them to feel like they’re part of it and they own it and big tech doesn’t have the right to rape and pillage our contributions and privacy for it.
An RSS feed does not provide the possibility to interact with the post. There were a good number of conversations between Lemmy users that got started off a mirrored Reddit post.
But you were unable to grow. Is the world’s most expensive restaurant worth anything if a handful of people only visited once?
Why?
Ownership, commitment, dedication. All the basic foundational community building stuff. If they can’t even be arsed enough to create a login in order to make a community, why would you trust them to run that community? If the communities aren’t successful, how will they attract users? Without users, how will the communities be successful? Without a flagship experience, how do you drum up business? Without customers, how long can you continue to offer hosting services?
What I am proposing is still based around ActivityPub and doesn’t throw the baby with the bathwater. Much like identity should not be coupled with the server running it, identity should not be coupled with your cryptographic keys.
There’s better uses of your time rather than worrying about the design of ActivityPub.
what is the benefit of having groups with similar interests spread around different communities?
Is there only one pub in your town?
That’s a given. I also promoted it on New Communities. I also made posts announcing the instances. I also asked people here to join. I’m still posting whatever content I think is relevant to these spaces.
I dunno, when I asked one of the moderators of one of the football specific communities to mirror his posts on your football instance, he said he’d never heard of it.
There is no such thing. There are a ton of smaller players besides MS and Google. Just as an example: I’ve been a migadu.com customer for years, paying $19/year for a couple of very important domains.
you were unable to grow (the mirror instances)
I was. It was so successful that there were people complaining about it, because they felt they were feeling tricked by it. The growth was there, I stopped (most of) the bots because the growth was not serving the intended purpose.
If they can’t even be arsed enough to create a login in order to make a community
You are missing one thing. The topic-specific instances are not open for registration. I do not want it to be a home of users, I want it to be the home of communities. This is based on the idea that your identity should not be tied to the domain.
It’s not because I like basketball that I’d ever want to have an @nba.space account. It’s not because you like to self host that your identity should be reduced to a selfhosted.forum domain, etc.
This is the gist of the “Federation and Identity” post. The things that I am working on will hopefully make it clearer, but for now suffice to say that the reason that people can not create communities on their own is because they are closed for registration and this is by design.
Only one pub in your town?
Physical locations are limited by physics.
People don’t go to a pub to talk around specific topics and interests
Sorry, we are not going to agree on this. Fragmenting groups for the sake of it serves no purpose other than keeping some misguided notion of “ownership”.
There is no such thing. There are a ton of smaller players besides MS and Google. Just as an example: I’ve been a migadu.com customer for years, paying $19/year for a couple of very important domains.
Heh, I just joined Migadu this week. But that aside, maybe duopoly is the wrong word. But last I checked there’s two major players and then a bunch of minnows and if you tried to spin up a self hosted email today, your emails would likely get bounced.
You are missing one thing. The topic-specific instances are not open for registration. I do not want it to be a home of users, I want it to be the home of communities. This is based on the idea that your identity should not be tied to the domain.
They go hand in hand. But let’s see how that changes with the third-party login work the Lemmy developers are working on.
It’s not because I like basketball that I’d ever want to have an @nba.space account. It’s not because you like to self host that your identity should be reduced to a selfhosted.forum domain, etc.
Indeed, but I liked self hosting enough to make an account on libretechni.ca even if I don’t use the account for much.
People don’t go to a pub to talk around specific topics and interests
Never been to a pub? 😂
Sorry, we are not going to agree on this. Fragmenting groups for the sake of it serves no purpose other than keeping some misguided notion of “ownership”.
Different pubs have different customers and atmospheres, despite both selling beer.
Third-party login is not going to change the fact that Lemmy servers (like every other server on Activity pub nowadays) connect the user identity to the server domain. It will maybe save people from creating yet another password, but that is about it.
Never been to a pub?
Have you been to any pub where the conversation goes around one specific topic and there are moderators to make sure the conversation stays within its guidelines? I surely haven’t.
I know this, you know this. But there’s things called hedged leveraging and acceptable loss.
This is important.
So why should someone trust you? You’re not emotionally involved nor committed.
So an RSS feed? Why does anyone need you then?
Bad idea.
Yes, you need people who are personally invested in order to build local and wider Fediverse communities.
You did a post and someone said, “you know you’re describing nostr” and that made me chuckle
It’s not personal criticism, it’s more observation and clash of ideals. I would prefer to see 20 small but equally active communities about baking, over one on the biggest instance. I wholeheartedly believe people need to get used to traveling around the Fediverse but also building up the communities they’re a member of.
Not the Reddit moderators, the Lemmy World ones.
So…
Something along those lines.
I’m getting the feeling that you are talking about things that more specific to Fediverser (the tools to help migration from Reddit to Lemmy, which is mostly an open source project) than Communick (which is a professional hosting service). But anyway.
My email provider is not “emotionally involved or committed” to my emails. Yet, I still trust them they will do their best to keep me using their services.
An RSS feed does not provide the possibility to interact with the post. There were a good number of conversations between Lemmy users that got started off a mirrored Reddit post.
Why?
Which is a myopic take. Nostr has a fundamental issue around identity management. They went too far to the other direction in the decentralization spectrum and will never be able to reach mainstream appeal. The only companies that are going to support it are (unsurprisingly) the ones that are owned or financed by Jack.
What I am proposing is still based around ActivityPub and doesn’t throw the baby with the bathwater. Much like identity should not be coupled with the server running it, identity should not be coupled with your cryptographic keys.
What you “prefer” has little to do with what people want. I agree that we should strive to spread around different instances, but what is the benefit of having groups with similar interests spread around different communities? If these “similar interests” turn out to not be so similar after all, sure then they can and should branch out. But I don’t understand what is the value of favoring an explosion of content spread around. Content discovery is already the biggest challenge in the Fediverse, by fragmenting more than needed we end up with a bunch of people just yelling in their rooms to themselves.
That’s a given. I also promoted it on New Communities. I also made posts announcing the instances. I also asked people here to join. I’m still posting whatever content I think is relevant to these spaces.
Isn’t that why we have a duopoly when it comes to email providers? The thing with the Fediverse is that we’re trying to change the culture of how people think and use the Internet. We need them to feel like they’re part of it and they own it and big tech doesn’t have the right to rape and pillage our contributions and privacy for it.
But you were unable to grow. Is the world’s most expensive restaurant worth anything if a handful of people only visited once?
Ownership, commitment, dedication. All the basic foundational community building stuff. If they can’t even be arsed enough to create a login in order to make a community, why would you trust them to run that community? If the communities aren’t successful, how will they attract users? Without users, how will the communities be successful? Without a flagship experience, how do you drum up business? Without customers, how long can you continue to offer hosting services?
There’s better uses of your time rather than worrying about the design of ActivityPub.
Is there only one pub in your town?
I dunno, when I asked one of the moderators of one of the football specific communities to mirror his posts on your football instance, he said he’d never heard of it.
There is no such thing. There are a ton of smaller players besides MS and Google. Just as an example: I’ve been a migadu.com customer for years, paying $19/year for a couple of very important domains.
I was. It was so successful that there were people complaining about it, because they felt they were feeling tricked by it. The growth was there, I stopped (most of) the bots because the growth was not serving the intended purpose.
You are missing one thing. The topic-specific instances are not open for registration. I do not want it to be a home of users, I want it to be the home of communities. This is based on the idea that your identity should not be tied to the domain.
It’s not because I like basketball that I’d ever want to have an @nba.space account. It’s not because you like to self host that your identity should be reduced to a selfhosted.forum domain, etc.
This is the gist of the “Federation and Identity” post. The things that I am working on will hopefully make it clearer, but for now suffice to say that the reason that people can not create communities on their own is because they are closed for registration and this is by design.
Physical locations are limited by physics.
People don’t go to a pub to talk around specific topics and interests
Sorry, we are not going to agree on this. Fragmenting groups for the sake of it serves no purpose other than keeping some misguided notion of “ownership”.
Heh, I just joined Migadu this week. But that aside, maybe duopoly is the wrong word. But last I checked there’s two major players and then a bunch of minnows and if you tried to spin up a self hosted email today, your emails would likely get bounced.
They go hand in hand. But let’s see how that changes with the third-party login work the Lemmy developers are working on.
Indeed, but I liked self hosting enough to make an account on libretechni.ca even if I don’t use the account for much.
Never been to a pub? 😂
Different pubs have different customers and atmospheres, despite both selling beer.
Third-party login is not going to change the fact that Lemmy servers (like every other server on Activity pub nowadays) connect the user identity to the server domain. It will maybe save people from creating yet another password, but that is about it.
Have you been to any pub where the conversation goes around one specific topic and there are moderators to make sure the conversation stays within its guidelines? I surely haven’t.