This has happened once before and they reversed it. But they said this last time too:
The discussions that have happened in various threads on Lemmy make it very clear that removing the communites before we announced our intent to remove them is not the level of transparency the community expects, and that as stewards of this community we need to be extremely transparent before we do this again in the future as well as make sure that we get feedback around what the planned changes are, because lemmy.world is yours as much as it is ours.
Can confirm, moved out of lemmy.world by this bullshit.
So start your own instance, with Blackjack and hookers?
As expected that’s the power of Lemmy!
Is lemmy.world trying to appeal to advertisers? Kinda sounds like it. Banning discussion oriented piracy subs, outlawing paywall bypassing in news@lemmy.world, etc.
Or maybe avoiding litigation? Weird that you think of advertising first, it’s like you don’t have critical thought.
I don’t.
Do they even have advertisers? Tbh I’ve had adblockers on for years I wouldn’t even know.
They don’t. It’s just wild speculation while in reality lemmy.world probably banned it because they got a legal notice and don’t want to get sued.
Lemmy is probably the worst place to sell to advertisers seen how many people run adblockers around here
I think they’re trying to appeal to law enforcement
idt they need to, unless they get a letter. the chances are astronomically low for that.
Stop crying about it and just join a new instance, pretty simple.
Yeah that. And I say it as someone who, on a good day, will go on philosophical rambles about how piracy is in fact the moral thing to do.
Do people just not get that this is the entire point of a decentralized system?
Hop accounts, you lil’ bitch. Don’t sit in one server complaining about the owner of that server when you have a billion options.
And if your priority is the piracy community? Make the server that hosts that your homeserver.
Or just have more than one account and use an app instead of the default webpage.
It’s not rocket science. People’s brains are poisoned by centralization. Back in my day everything was its own separate forum with its own separate account and to be honest, it was miles better like that.
The problem with this is that it isn’t really decentralized equally. Lemmy.world has most of the users and getting defederated from them is essentially a death sentence in terms of content and engagement.
I think it’s a good idea to make new accounts on other instances, I plan to but without a proper amount of people, lemmy.world is working the same way reddit did.
Hopefully this will drive people to switch to another instance, and the issue you mentions will be less present.
The problem with this is that it isn’t really decentralized equally. Lemmy.world has most of the users and getting defederated from them is essentially a death sentence in terms of content and engagement.
Self-resolving issue here. If people hop away from LW due to LW making decisions they don’t like, LW will cease being the one-go-to-place for stuff. Which is good, it shouldn’t be. No one instance should be “the main instance”. The right way to use federation is each person & community should make their home at a place where they vibe just right with the fed admins. It’s even good for LW itself as it reduces the burden on its server and the workload for its admins.
Also also – Defederation is a far more nuanced thing than just “is block”. There is more than one tool that can be used by an ActivityPub admin.
If LW defederates from your home instance – You can still manually follow communities that are in LW AND interact with them (unless the admins go out of their way to ALSO block USERS from your home instance), as “defederated from the instance” just removes it from the global timeline/global community search.
What happened here, though, wasn’t defederation, it was a block, and a block on two specific communities, which outright prevents viewing & interacting with content from those communities from within LW. Which brings me to: LW’s block on the piracy communities from dbzer0 doesn’t stop LW users from interacting with dbzer0 as a whole. Or vice-versa. Only with stuff from the piracy coms.
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You… Got a refund on a donation? Wow…
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If I may ask, why still use .world then?
Great question, see when instances have management level disagreements like this there really isn’t any purpose to using their communities from a remote account.
Unlike a lot of people who “migrated” I realize it ultimately doesn’t make a difference using these communities from a remote server because they are controlled by this one and ultimately will be affected by defederations and bans. So I only migrated my non-lemmy.world subscriptions to the other instance accounts and left the local ones on this account.
I did that the last time and moved here ( ͡° ͜ʖ ͡°)
Better management, no censorship, better uptimes and quicker upgrades, no need to look back (I moved “momentarily”).
Here being where exactly?
I think “here” being the instance their account is on, https://lemm.ee
Yep :)
I forgot some apps or frontends might not show up instance names next to usernames.
quicker upgrades
That’s an important one, especially with how long it took LW to upgrade. I completely get why it’s more challenging for them due to their number of users, but that could be an argument for enthusiastic users to move elsewhere.
Reddit syndrome still affects a lot of users here, who view having multiple accounts on different answers as an inconvenience instead of a feature of the platform design. The irony is that tons of users on Reddit had lots of accounts without batting an eye, but that extra step of having to lick a new instance is just SO complicated.
It is an inconvenience. Having to track which account can view which communities, with all the drama and defederation happening each week isn’t easy.
Centralized Reddit brain poison tbh.
Your password manager will keep track of your credentials. If you have THAT MUCH trouble keeping track of which communities are on which server, stick to local communities.
Back in the day we had everything be its own separate forum and no one died from that. You’re just lazy.
Nice bait dude.
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Picking a better instance for your main is most advisable. Users can accept that the primary benefit of a free and open source federated service can also sometimes inconvenience them, or they cannot. Complaining about the core mechanic of the technology that literally cannot change is silly IMO. Corporate owned centralization leads to enshittification. Your account age indicates that you know that first hand.
Indeed. There are lots of proposals for perfectly portable decentralized user identities, subscriptions that transcend specific instances, and whatnot, but until those things actually arrive that’s not the Fediverse we’re dealing with. It’s a hassle having to switch instances.
It’s a major inconvenience and I’ll stick to one. If it can’t be accessed from Lemmy.world it’s not really my problem tbh and I’ll just act like it doesn’t exist.
I’ve never noticed any defederation from my instance or drama aside from the main posts talking about it, and if you came here interested in a piracy community it’s good for that, lemmy.dbzer0.com. “Lemmy.World” seems to be where all the drama happens hah. I have only ever made one account, interact with several different instances without issue. I agree using several accounts would be annoying.
Lemmy.world is a fucking shithole. It’s teenage life crisis tumblr in here.
Luckily, you can always move elsewhere :)
The pirates will simply move to another Lemmy Instance and re-create the group there. This is the advantage of having a decentralized platform: so one person or small group of people can’t ruin things for the rest of us.
These communities not on .world.
They are: !piracy@lemmy.dbzer0.com !piracy@lemmy.ml !steamdeckpirates@lemmy.dbzer0.com
Pirates will not move the communities. The communities are fine where they are. People will need to create accounts on the host instances or instances that haven’t blocked those communities.
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Yeah people are really weird about this. They want a free distributed forum hosted by small admins, but don’t want those individuals to take basic legal precautions? Piracy might be moral, but it’s a liability which will absolutely impact the viability of servers in many places. Grow up.
I mean, it’s not on their server. It’s hosted on dbzer0.
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i really wish there were a way to disable images with some of these fancy lemmy clients for android. I’m not interested in any of them
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nice. yea it replaces your image with a link.
Neat. Has anyone brought this up to the devs here or on github before?
you could safeguard against this on the client side by not loading images from untrusted sources. irc clients did this
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Got the state correct 👍
Ayo what the fuck how’d you do that
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Oof, yeah that’s bad…
But of they federated they’ll be hosting a copy.
I guess the question is: if you host a public forum, are you liable for things posted on it, or on separate but linked forums?
You might not have to pay damages. But you’re probably going to have to pay a hefty legal fee not to pay damages.
Copyright laws are actually very difficult to enforce when it comes to digital piracy. You have to prove loss of profit among other things.
Then, who do you sue? The person downloading the product? The person hosting the product? The person providing a link to the hosted data? The person providing a platform for people to link things? The person who allows their platform to federate with another platform that does?
If we’re talking about P2P sharing, then in a way no one is hosting the data.
In Australia when the Dallas Buyers Club case was being looked at, the studio was asking for a lot of money. Basically a big fat fine to be paid. The judge threw it out saying that the only reasonable damages for one person to pay would be the cost of the DVD because that was the value of the “theft”.
You dont have to enforce it.
You just have to drown people in legal bills and force them into compliance with risk of bankruptcy.
I don’t know enough about law to know how that does or does not work, but it that’s possible then any entity with enough money can actively bankrupt anyone they want, and it won’t have anything to do with why. If that’s true could you not just sue someone by making stuff up and force them to prove you made it up?
thepiratebay.org is still up
they did go to prison tho
their apartment in Malmö looked and smelled like a triceratops hibernated in there, by the way
I guess the question is: if you host a public forum, are you liable for things posted on it, or on separate but linked forums?
I was thinking the same thing, as a legal question.
In the Fediverse, who’s the source/target for the law to look at, the originator, or all the cached copies on other servers?
Edit: Basically, what this comment describes…
Then, who do you sue? The person downloading the product? The person hosting the product? The person providing a link to the hosted data? The person providing a platform for people to link things? The person who allows their platform to federate with another platform that does?
If we’re talking about P2P sharing, then in a way no one is hosting the data.
It doesn’t matter if you don’t have limitless money to pay lawyers
Comments like this sound like the “they write it off on tax” comments, where there’s this assumption about how complex things must work, but it can’t work exactly that way otherwise we would see it happening all the time.
It doesn’t matter if you don’t have limitless money to pay lawyers
Since anyone can spin up a Lemmy server, at some point a rich person/persons will do so, which makes this a relevant question to ask.
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The Lemmy instance doesn’t actually host pirated content, does it? It’s just information about pirated content and where to find it, right? Who the fuck cares about this
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Yeah, we should run this shit through Somalia, they don’t give a f u c k.
What a bunch of fucking clowns.
Anyways… !piracy@lemmy.dbzer0.com
That returns an error.
Is there another instance you’d recommend?
I can see it just fine. ᕕ( ᐛ )ᕗ
Making a new account isn’t difficult; I chose my instance specifically because I wanted access to that particular community.
Which instance do you recommend?
I mean, dbzer0 is the one I actively use, so that one. It’s an anarchist instance, it’s the one that hosts the community, and I happen to align with the prevelant way of thinking, which made the decision fairly easy.
Try this link: lemmy.dbzer0.com/c/piracy
Hi there! Looks like you linked to a Lemmy community using a URL instead of its name, which doesn’t work well for people on different instances. Try fixing it like this: !piracy@lemmy.dbzer0.com
Heartbreaking - AI Is Starting To Take The Jobs Of People Who Make Unhelpful Corrections On The Internet
genious!!!
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PSA: Lemmy.ml has a piracy community and federates with everyone world federates with so you can have the same experience.
do you have any proof of this?
I assume I’d have to hack into the CCP’s computer networks to get proof.
what’s the point of making things up like this, then?
Wow, personal attacks from a lemmy.ml user, truly shocking.
i didn’t make any personal attacks, and i’m on kolektiva
You essentially called me a liar, that’s an attack.
Don’t waste your time, that user is delusional.
I just searched “china”, and didn’t notice any authoritarian propaganda in the first 3 pages, but I counted 6 anti-chinese stories.
The closest to pro-chinese stories that came up were that EU citizens can now travel to China visa-free, the CEO of evergrande getting fined and banned from business, and some news story about economic numbers.
Would you care to point it out to me?
Propaganda isn’t obvious like that, and the core of most propaganda is truthful. Generally speaking you need to look at the big picture and what key actors want to be able to see probable propaganda.
They’ll never say “the CCP is great and Taiwanese people don’t deserve freedom,” but they undermine people who would defend Taiwan and help shape things so an attack is more likely to succeed (e.g., supporting the Kremlin’s attack on Ukrainians).
Not really interested in discussing it more with a Lemmy.ml user. I’ve seen too much bad faith engagement and don’t want to waste my time. Apologies if you’re actually sincere.
I think I see the disconnect, you conflate the safety of the state of Taiwan and Ukraine with the people so statements like “I don’t think we should sacrifice a million Ukrainians to weaken Russia” come off as undermining the defense of Ukraine.
I’m certain even the pro-independence people living in Taiwan would prefer status quo to looking like Ukraine.
you conflate the safety of the state of Taiwan and Ukraine with the people
I don’t understand what you’re trying to say
its pretty clear. You’re conversing with a tankie.
My guess is it’s actually an LLM.
A state and it’s people’s interests aren’t the same.
Take self-determination movements; the people in eastern Ukraine want to leave, the state of Ukraine doesn’t want to give up territory.
Supporting the state in this case is opposing the people, supporting the people is opposing the state.
If I was in Russia, I’d have pointed at Syrian Kurdistan before the US invasion/occupation of Syria.
Examples?
I occasionally see this argument but not yet seen any evidence to back it up.
Same here. I discuss a lot with .ml and besides dumping on capitalism a lot (and rightfully so), I havent seen anything supporting this claim either.
and federates with everyone world federates with
Not entirely true, I discovered the other day, while helping someone figure out why they couldn’t access .ml communities, that .ml blocks furry instances…
Edit: https://lemmy.ml/instances includes Pawb.social and pawb.fun, they’re also federated with instances that host furry communities.
Which furry instances are you talking about?
Yiffit.net, ani.social, and lemmynsfw.com. Those are the main defederations that I think are a little harsh.
Aside from those, most of the other blocked instances are pretty egregious (mostly pedophilia and alt-right) and SJW has blocked many of the same ones.
The only major server with less defederation is Lemm.ee.
Lemm.ee is pretty sweet and well run. Ml and ee are superior to world IMHO.
shhhhh
Never seen evidence of that…
Yeah, I’m sure you haven’t.
Oh yeah, I forgot .world allows porn instances.
Aren’t all three of those used for porn
ani social was anime related, but the admins banned it because they dont really like anime and just tag reasons for censorship as loli, without evidence of it. I dont even actively contribute to the anime community, but was the driving reason why i moved from ml to zip. didnt want to have to deal with unsubstantial censorship with an actual valid reason.
On the other hand, I really would not be surprised if they did have banworthy content on there.
im not doubting the possibility, but not to even provide evidence to the servers admins is a red flag on pushing the ml dev/admins agendas without being transparent about it.
without a level of transparency, the same reason can be used to unjustfully ban anything.
we don’t. i know the anime community on the internet doesn’t have a good reputation but it’s different here. @hitagi@ani.social makes sure of that.
Idk about ani.social but the other two are. Ani.social has a general anime discussion community that was created as a replacement for the anime community on lemmy.ml and has rapidly surpassed it in activity. You’re not allowed to link !anime@ani.social on lemmy.ml either.
Lemmy.ml admins would argue they host loli/pedo content, but ani.social would argue it’s just mainstream anime content and it’s part of the genre. I don’t really know more than that, but I think it’s a bit unfair to describe the whole ani.social server as being used for porn.
Hi, here’s your pretty much useless furry check.
Double meaning entirely intentional, because funny.
I think it was specifically Yiffit.
lemmy ml de-federates with communites and instances without even a reason, not to say that their moderations actions weren’t questionable in the past and present.
When “reddit outside of reddit” does reddit things 🫨
When the people using a free service you’re not obligated to provide try and shame you for not taking on multimillion dollar legal departments.
The communities they banned are only for the discussion of piracy(whick is legal). There are no copyrighted material hosted in any of them.
It doesn’t matter if they’re blessed by the Pope himself. The people who run the instance get to decide what moves through it.
Yes, and I can voice my dissatisfaction with it. I’m not sure what your point is other than trying to tell me to shut up in a more verbose way.
To be fair, Rudd is just a hobbyist who runs .world in his spare time. If he’s getting legal pressure, he’s probably going to cover his ass. He’s not a company with a legal dept. He’s a guy with a family and a day job.
Another problem is .world part of US-centric instance
The benefit is that it isn’t just another reddit but rather network of reddits
Banned on one? Get from another.
I’m referring specifically to lemmy.world, not to all of lemmy or even the fediverse.
EDIT: dbzer0 had nothing to do with this ban, it was done by a Lemmy.World admin.
I updated my post after another user stated that it wasn’t lemmy.world admins that performed the ban but the db0 team that did. I can’t say with certainty that’s actually the case since the modlog is pretty opaque and I don’t have full knowledge of how [federated] actions are propagated & displayed.I (incorrectly?) assumed since those communities had existed for so long on the dbzer0 instance they had at least tacit approval from the admins there and were in communication with them enough that a full ban wouldn’t occur – when I saw the removal in the modlog I didn’t even consider that possibility.Sorry for kicking up drama here if the Lemmy.World team had no part in this :(Here is the modlog: https://lemmy.world/modlog?page=1&actionType=ModRemoveCommunity
Seems to have been made by a mod from LW indeed
Sigh… if “indirectly linking” is prohibited then literally the entire web breaks.
When you check the mod logs and filter by mod you can see that it came from Mr. Kaplan which is a lemmy.world admin.
So yes it was a lemmy.world decision. The question is whether or not this admin was a lone actor.
Sad that antipiracy laws are in place.
But understandable that lemmy.world protect themselves against those unfair laws.
The sailing will continue, but, as always, we should be wary of the “navy” and sail with precaution.
I never sail without protection
This isn’t reddit. There’s a clear solution here: decentralization. Aka, like the entire point why we’re on Lemmy in the first place. Join another instance lol.
Absolutely! Does anyone have any suggestions for general instances that don’t censor as much as lemmy.world?
This is a great site to find instances:
“No! I refuse to open more than one site! If it’s not on this one site that I have decided amounts to the entire threadiverse then it doesn’t exist, how dare people make me think? The absurdity of it all!”
.world users doing their thing. It’s fine for a starter but not someplace to stay
cum
Well this comment section was an interesting read. Interesting how many comments still bend the discussion towards bashing lemmy.ml and defederating from it. People, it’s not even the topic of this post?
Also it seems like very few actually read the post beyond the title? The problem is not lemmy.world banning the piracy community, they have the right to do so, that’s how federation works. The problem is them making a promise to make announcements about such bans in advance, but they instead did it quietly in the background again.
