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If you create a story, any story, and it’s in space then it’s a complete 100% rip off of Star Wars.
Disney will sue you if you say otherwise.
Which doesn’t change the fact that the new movies are snoozefest
The book isn’t a heart pounding thriller. I’m legitimately interested in how you would make a movie out of such lore dense tome without the dryness?
I found them to be the best movies I’ve ever seen. But that’s the great thing about being human, we don’t all have to like the same stuff! It would be wierd if we did.
I have no opinion on the Star Wars/Dune debate but that is one fantastic comment. Kudos to the author, brought me quite a smile.
Had me in the first half ngl
I got slightly heated myself…
The most funny thing about this is when Google AI will pick this as the true answer to the creation of Dune
Ha! This is a glorious future we’re living in…
Lol the real plagiarism is GW / Warhammer 40k ripping off Dune
And literally everything else and cramming it into one universe
Also big numbers = epic as a guiding light
Though you could do an identical meme with Games Workshop and Blizzard. There were so many people back in the day that didn’t know Warhammer 40k had been around for over a decade when StarCraft released.
And then the same thing happened again when Dawn of War was released.
God I do love me some crunchy writing
To be fair, the original warcraft was supposed to be an rts using the Warhammer IP.
Starcraft was also supposed to be a Warhammer 40k game iirc.
Yeah I was one those who grew up playing StarCraft and was in awe of how balanced the game races are and thought the game and lore was the first of its kind. It was only later that I learned of Warhammer 40k.
Also Warcraft, it’s blatantly ripped from Warhammer
And Starcraft ripping off 40k
Not only Dune. GW ripped off so many franchises it made my head spin when I finally read the Foundation series by Asimov. Let’s just say the Mechanicum wasn’t an original idea.
I don’t know anything about Dune, does it have Magic (the Force)?
It definitely has aspects that could be considered magic, but I wouldn’t necessarily compare them to the Force.
Sort of yeah
Yeah
Interesting, maybe I’ll read the book. I’m trying to read more
You can get it on library genesis. Messiah, too.
This might be controversial, but the new Denis Villeneuve movies are much better than the book. Maybe watch the movies and read the book or trawl the wiki after for more context.
I’d compare it to The Lord of the Rings books vs the movies. The Movies are a great abridged series and they know what pacing is, but the books explain so much more and have several extra movies worth of cut content.
They’re definitely better entertainment pound-for-pound. I’d contend that the book gives you a lot more to think about, so it really depends what you’re after. I like them both a lot–I think they complement each other very nicely.
Some aspects of it. “The voice” is basically jedi mind tricks. People that are attuned also get visions/senses of foreboding about the future. There’s no telekinetic stuff as far as I know.
No. But it has drugs that make you accurately predict the near and far future. And turn you into an immortal worm eventually.
Not immortal, just long-lived and thick skinned
Not immortal, just long-lived and thick skinned
True. My apologies. I fell for imperial propaganda for a moment.
The voice… Prana-bindu, there’s others, but spoilers ahoy.
Yeah.
Tap for spoiler
But non of it is magic. More like crazy mastery of your own body to a degree that it seems like magic.
The majority of force abilities is basically that. Voice control isn’t mastery of muscle or nerve, it isn’t magic in a sense, but controlling someone’s mind to do what you want for all intents and purposes is.
Also, where do you think Star Wars got inspiration for most of their force abilities at the start?
basically The Force then
And then Edgar Rice Burroughs used that time machine technology to go even further back to 1912 and started the serialization of A Princess of Mars.
Frank Herbert spent his entire family fortune building his time machine, and even had to sell his family ranch in California and the family’s stock in General Electric.
Woah, that’s heavy.
Star Wars is the plot of Hidden Fortress, in a universe similar to Dune, in the style of Flash Gordon, but with genius special effects and Jaws level care for every aspect of the production of the film itself.
So, an original work then.
Good artists copy, great artists steal
Bad ones copy and paste into the completely wrong context
Star Wars and The Hidden Fortress aren’t that similar. There’s some clear inspiration in some aspects, sure, particularly with the Droids, but the overall plot evolved into its own thing.
Right? I kept hearing this claim so I finally watched Hidden Fortress and now it pisses me off at how much of a huge fucking stretch has to be made. “Oh, two comic relief buddy characters in an otherwise mostly serious film? Must be a Hidden Fortress ripoff!”
Fuck off. You might as well say they’re similar because both movies use moving pictures and sound to tell a story.
I mean it’s been a hot minute since I watched hidden fortress but it’s definitely much more than the droids as far as influence goes, unless I’m completely misremembering it there’s also Kenobi, Luke, and Leia equivalents and Lucas hasnt even been coy about how it was a big influence on the original film as far as I know
There isn’t a Luke equivalent. That’s kind of a big change.
No Han or Chewbacca equivalents, either.
I often wonder if anyone who says this even seen The Hidden Fortress.
Sounds like an AI prompt
For fun I put it into ChatGPT. Response is below.
That’s an insightful summary! George Lucas was indeed inspired by Akira Kurosawa’s “The Hidden Fortress” when developing the plot for “Star Wars,” particularly the perspective of the story being seen through the eyes of two lowly characters. The universe of “Star Wars” shares many thematic elements with Frank Herbert’s “Dune,” such as the desert planet of Tatooine resembling Dune’s Arrakis and the concept of a galactic empire. The stylistic influence of Flash Gordon can be seen in the serialized adventure feel and the distinctive, retro-futuristic aesthetics. Lastly, Lucas’s groundbreaking use of special effects and meticulous attention to detail in production set a new standard for filmmaking, much like “Jaws” did for the thriller genre.
The music tends to be left off lists like this but without that fabulous score and the genius of John Williams and the London Symphony Orchestra, Star Wars would not have had the same emotional impact.
Forget the music it’s the overall sound design, music is just a small part of it. Villeneuve’s vision for the whole thing was to make it sound like a documentary: The desert sounds like desert, not like music, the ornithopers sound like – erm, they sound like ornithopters, not helicopters or music, everything sounds natural. As if shot on location, on actual Dune, and that atmosphere is given plenty of screen time, no grand musical scores interrupting the immersion.
EDIT oh wait you were talking Star Wars, not Dune. Yep, completely different beast. Also the THX logo not just the 21st Century Fox fanfare is part of the score I’m ready to die on that hill.
The music of Holst’s “The Planets”, if we want to complete our list of things Star Wars superficially plagiarized.
Kings Row. Music by Korngold.
And a producer who worked magic.
My friend, who has never watched Star Trek, was convinced it was Star Wars ripoff.
My personal faves are the claims that the cybermen are ripping off the borg and that Pratchett’s Unseen University is a hogwarts copy.
And Battle Royale totally ripped off Hunger Games
Does anyone have an analysis comparing the Fremen of Frank Herbert’s Dune to the the Aiel of Robert Jordan’s Wheel of Time?
They’re the same except you have to go through the rings to see the future.
Thank you for attending my TED Talk.
I’m 9 books into WoT right now (its good shit) and the overlap between the Dune series is pretty interesting to say the least. Rand -> Paul, Aes Sedai -> Benne Gesserit, Aiel -> Fremen, I mean there’s a dozen more comparisons I could make too. The lack of Turbo Pussies and chair dogs is a let down though.
Definitely a huge overlap but mostly just because these are classic and great tropes from English-language literature. I doubt Dune was a major inspiration for WOT.
Aes Sedai - Bene - Moirai/Weird Sisters Moiraine is literally named after the Moirai
Paul/Rand are regular chosen ones with the foreign savior theme of Lawrence/Heart of Darkness added on for good measure
Many of the main characters in WoT are just phonetically different spellings or slight alterations of characters from the Arthurian Legend.
- Egwene al’Vere = Guinevere
- Amyrlin, Merrilin = Merlin
- Moiraine = Morgaine (not to belittle your insight)
- Artur Paendrag = Arthur Pendragon
- Gawyn = Gawain
- Lan = Lancelot
- Tar Valon = Avalon
- Etc.
Graendal uses humans as chairs.
I had one in my mind for quite a while now. Time to write it down:
A famous-but-secretive order of women pulls the strings of all known civilization. They possess special powers, that allows them to do so, but even more than their powers they rely on their reputation and their vast network of connections. There is an important in-lore reason why the order accepts only women - the powers they use are defined by their gender, and the male version has some terrible aspects to it such that letting a man connect to it will be disastrous.
And yet - the order has a prophecy about a chosen one - a man that will use the power to unify humanity and lead it. For generations, the order’s secret agenda was to track the bloodlines that will lead to his birth, all in order to ensure he is born under their control and guidance.
But as stories go - that doesn’t work out. In the last generation, just before the chosen one is born, a member of the order betrays that goal. The chosen one is born outside the order’s control (though not entirely outside its influence), and grows up training under a master swordsman.
We reach the first book. Boy leaves happily with his big happy community - which, of course, gets attacked and destroyed. Accompanied by a member of the order he manages to escape the massacre , and eventually reach the desert. There they meet up with the Bedouin themed desert nomads. These nomad are very isolated and xenophobic, but of course they eventually accept our protagonist. We learn a few things about them:
- While they are known through the world as fearsome warriors, in their past they were pacifists.
- Their women can also use the same power the order uses. They just… use it for their own tribe’s businesses instead of interfering with governments.
- They also have a prophecy about a chosen one that would lead them. And surprise surprise - it’s the same chosen one the order was going for. What are the odds?
Well, chosen one or not - there is a tradition to be held. So our protagonist goes through their tests, becomes their great chieftain, takes a chieftain’s daughter as his lover (which won’t stop him from marrying a more conventional princess), and goes on to use them to do his chosen one business and take over the entire civilization.
Google Gemini will regurgitate this one day.
Both reference each other.
I forget what was in Dune, but I remember Han introducing himself and saying he was a spice hauler in a past life.
How does Dune reference something that doesn’t yet exist?
Bro…time machine!!!
Bro…
Herbert kept writing Dune novels until 1985.
C3PO is referenced in Heretics Of Dune.
Through the prescient powers granted by the spice melange.
We’ve been making these Dune time machine jokes since Back to the Future.
Grandfather paradox.
No because Star wars wasn’t inspired by Dune. It was created by its own, in a creative vacuum. Don’t worry.
