• cygnus@lemmy.ca
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    3 months ago

    Getting the old gang back together! Too bad Russia is on the other side this time.

    • Shard@lemmy.world
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      3 months ago

      They’ve always been “that acquaintance”.

      You only know each other for mutual benefit or a mutual friend, but when that’s gone, there becomes literally no reason to hang out any more.

    • shottymcb@lemm.ee
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      3 months ago

      Considering Russia’s past performance in naval warfare in the Pacific, we’re probably better off without them.

      • cygnus@lemmy.ca
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        3 months ago

        I don’t mean to pick on you specifically with this comment, but good lord people, there’s more to history than WW2. Anytime anyone tries to make a historical reference to current events it’s awkwardly shoehorned into a WW2 framework. It drives me crazy. Anyway, sorry for the rant there. No, it’s an older gang. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Scramble_for_China

        • UnderpantsWeevil@lemmy.world
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          3 months ago

          Ah, you’re talking about colonialism. You’re going to have a hard time finding anti-colonialists on Lemmy, unfortunately.

          • cygnus@lemmy.ca
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            3 months ago

            Nah, it was just a throwaway joke, the west obviously doesn’t intend to colonize China this time. What they did in the 19th century was egregious, though, and should be much more common knowledge than it is.

            • UnderpantsWeevil@lemmy.world
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              3 months ago

              the west obviously doesn’t intend to colonize China this time

              The Chinese state is a much harder nut to crack under the CCP than it was a century and a half ago under the Qing Dynasty. But there are plenty of John Bolton-esque figures in the American government who seem willing to give it the old college try.

              What they did in the 19th century was egregious, though, and should be much more common knowledge than it is.

              It’s very difficult to talk about the English Empire as the world’s premier opium cartel without taking a bit of the blush off the rose of liberal democracy and free market capitalism. These historical blemishes get dusted over for a reason.

              • cygnus@lemmy.ca
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                3 months ago

                It’s very difficult to talk about the English Empire as the world’s premier opium cartel without taking a bit of the blush off the rose of liberal democracy and free market capitalism. These historical blemishes get dusted over for a reason.

                I agree, but that reflex is unfortunate because the ability to openly discuss and confront those things is what sets democracies apart from totalitarian states. You could never see that kind of frank introspection in China regarding June 4th '89, for example.

                • UnderpantsWeevil@lemmy.world
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                  3 months ago

                  You could never see that kind of frank introspection in China regarding June 4th '89, for example.

                  You could and did. That moment radically transformed how the Deng Administration treated independent political movements, college student activism, and old guard Maoist organizations.

                  The argument that Chinese politicians and scholars simply don’t acknowledge the events as happening is Western propaganda.

                  • cygnus@lemmy.ca
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                    3 months ago

                    Cool, how long did you live there? Do you still have contacts on the mainland?

    • Rakonat@lemmy.world
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      3 months ago

      The fact that Russia was ever on the winning side given their history was a fluke.

      • cygnus@lemmy.ca
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        3 months ago

        Eh, they were also instrumental in defeating Napoleon, which counts for a lot.

    • fuckingkangaroos@lemm.ee
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      3 months ago

      Russia was always on another side. The Ribbentrop Pact was a weak, untrusting handshake between two barbaric regimes with mutual hatred and a shared realization it would be easier to go rape and pillage more peaceful people instead of each other.