The Israeli rescue service Zaka says its paramedics removed more than 260 bodies from a music festival that came under attack by Hamas militants.

The total figure of bodies found is expected to be higher, as other paramedic teams were also working in the area and Zaka added that the bodies “haven’t all been collected yet”.

Early on Saturday morning, Hamas targeted Nova music festival, a techno rave in the desert near the border with Gaza.

Videos shared on social media and by Israeli news outlets showed dozens of festival-goers running through an open field as gunshots rang out. Many hid in nearby fruit orchards or were gunned down as they fled.

  • nbafantest@lemmy.world
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    1 year ago

    There’s a lot of commenting from westerners about this, but it’s not going to matter. Israel is going to wipe out Hamas. Hopefully the regular Palestinians survive with out much damage. And in the future they have a better life.

    But it is very clear the people of Israel are very united in what they’re need to do and how to do it.

    • Rotten_potato@lemmy.world
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      1 year ago

      So far the Israeli government under Netanyahu has mostly done things to strengthen Hamas, a more radical and violent (but controlled by the vastly stronger Israeli military, or so they thought) group in power in Gaza was deemed beneficial since it prevents the formation of “reasonable”, anti-violent advocates for Palestinian liberation. Didn’t really work out that well I guess.

        • Barbarian@sh.itjust.works
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          1 year ago

          I don’t think this will strengthen Netanyahu. People will want blood for the biggest intelligence failure since 9/11.

          In fact, this is worse than 9/11, at least there it was a relatively small number of people involved. How on earth does Mossad miss thousands of armed militants, vehicles, guns, logistics and planning for an attack of this scale? The only two options are intentionally keeping this quiet or incompetence at a breathtaking scale. Neither of those two options are good for Netanyahu.

        • TheSanSabaSongbird@lemdro.id
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          1 year ago

          That remains to be seen. In situations like this people tend to either double down on, or turn against their leaders. I think the dust needs to settle a little more before we know which way the wind is blowing for Netanyahu. My hunch is that you are probably right, at least in the short-term.

    • TheBlue22@lemmy.blahaj.zone
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      1 year ago

      I don’t think they want to wipe them out. The government of izrael needs Hamas for their own selfish reasons. Without a proper enemy, a proper “them”, such a fascist government like Izrael cannot exist

    • dangblingus@lemmy.dbzer0.com
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      1 year ago

      I expect to see reports of wholesale slaughter of Palestinian civilians. You know, normal every day stuff for the IDF.

    • gmtom@lemmy.world
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      1 year ago

      regular Palestinians

      “What regular Palestinians? Those doctors and children were clearly armed militants” - the IDF probably.

      • 🐱TheCat@sh.itjust.works
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        1 year ago

        I heard an Israeli coworker claim that the IDF is the worlds most moral army. With blind-belief like that, they are gonna commit some crazy atrocities.

      • astral_avocado@lemm.ee
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        1 year ago

        I’ve read Hamas specifically runs military operations in civilian buildings like hospitals as a meat shield, is that not true?

        • nednobbins@lemm.ee
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          1 year ago

          This is a claim regularly made by the IDF. It seems fairly likely and I haven’t seen any evidence to the contrary.

          I’m not sure how different that is from deliberately putting civilian settlements in a hotly contested buffer zone though.

          • hassanmckusick@lemmy.discothe.quest
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            1 year ago

            Bro you are cracked.

            This is a claim regularly made by the IDF. It seems fairly likely and I haven’t seen any evidence to the contrary.

            “I have 0 evidence in either direction but the propaganda I like tells me X”

            How are people who are getting bombed supposed to provide you evidence to the contrary? Why is it not on the State of Israel to prove that their targets have military personnel inside before they kill the civilians?

            Take away the fact that Israel routinely bombs news buildings, ya know the buildings with the cameras and networks capable of providing evidence, what kind of evidence could they even provide that would make you say “no I’m wrong”?

            Lets say the people in AP building ran around and took pictures before the bombing and showed no one in Hamas gear before the bombing, people would just shift the goalposts and say “well they could take off their military gear and hide as civilians”, “oh those pictures could be fake”, “how do we know they were even taken at the right time?”

            As soon as you’ve accepted the premise that Israel can kill civilians first and ask questions later you’ve lost the plot.

            • nednobbins@lemm.ee
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              1 year ago

              I don’t think you finished reading my comment in the first place but I’ll expand on it.

              Terrorists/freedom fighters/insurgents (whatever you want to call them) regularly have their operations in civilian buildings; the IRA did it, the country formerly known as the 13 colonies did it, Boxers did it, ETA did it… It’s just standard MO because they have no choice.

        • gmtom@lemmy.world
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          1 year ago

          Yes. but any sort of resistance/guerilla movement does the exact same thing. From the American revolution to the French Resistance.

    • vivadanang@lemm.ee
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      1 year ago

      Israel is going to wipe out Hamas.

      Honest question: to Israelis that want to see this, what does this mean? forcing the Palestinians out completely to Jordan and Lebanon?

      don’t get me wrong, it’d be awesome if you could just magically zap the terrorists, but that’s not reality. so what’s the end game with this kind of rhetoric?

      • Ð Greıt Þu̇mpkin@lemm.ee
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        1 year ago

        Nuremberg scenario if we’re lucky.

        It turned Germany from antisemitism central into Europe’s strongest economy and democracy, at least up until the AfD started trying to weasel the nazi shit back in.

        Problem is this isn’t the allies making the call here, it’s Israel, who’s a lot more interested in just crippling Gaza industrially and militarily to the point that rocket assembly and launching become an impossibility, so either absolutely flattening the place, or permanently occupying the place until Fatah or another faction that’s not as batshit insane as Hamas are able to pretend to be in control while basically being a paper government where Israel’s “security concerns” clash with Gaza’s sovereignty.

        • vivadanang@lemm.ee
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          1 year ago

          Yeah, Hamas basically destroyed themselves with this shit. The rest of the world watched their warcriming and said “You know, perhaps these aren’t the folks that peace can be reached with, go nuts Israel, bomb the shit out of them.”

          Who’s gonna stand up for Hamas at this point, russia and iran? pfft… get fucked. Any plausible case for their victimhood got lost when they went down this road.

      • Landmammals@lemmy.world
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        1 year ago

        Correct me if I’m wrong but isn’t Hamas the political body that is in control of the Gaza strip?

        They sent a military force to go kill civilians. I don’t know how much of Israel’s motivation is to take the Gaza strip back and move Palestinian civilians around, but killing that many civilians has definitely put Hamas into “fuck around and find out” territory. At the very least I would expect that Israel will not stop until Hamas is no longer a political entity in Gaza.

      • PitzNR@sh.itjust.works
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        1 year ago

        I just want to be clear, I’m stating my opinion, no one else’s, it might be the consensus in Israel, it might be not. I’ve always been against a lot of my country and military actions, especially against Palestinians, never saw them as enemies, even as a soldier I spoke out if something seemed wrong to me, even in operation protective edge I’ve been told that I shouldn’t live here if I care so much about the Palestinian, this was told to me by a soldier that I was carrying food and water for, what I’m saying is that I’m not some right wing hateful nut job when I say: I don’t give a shut anymore, I don’t give a shit where the gazan will go, I don’t give a shit if they don’t have food, I don’t give a shit about any of this, In 24 hours, three friends have lost half of their families, two friends have been held hostages, one friend kidnapped to Gaza, presumably dead. As much as a pacifist I tried to be my whole life, right now I want nothing but the sea to be painted red by the blood of the people who did this and supported it, and quite honestly, when this is all over, I want our elected officials to be rounded up, faced against the wall and be shot.

        • Rawdogg@lemm.ee
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          1 year ago

          I hope the people you know who got killed suffered, fucking colonisers scum

        • teuniac_@lemmy.world
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          1 year ago

          I am sorry you lost several loved ones. I can’t imagine what that must be like.

          Hopefully, while grieving, you won’t be stuck in anger for much longer. The people that you have lost wouldn’t want children to pay the price for your country’s revenge.

          Of course you want Hamas to be brought to justice, but there are many people like you and I in Gaza that are just trying to live a life free of violence. Hamas might kill indiscriminately, but they are a terrorist/radical group. A country must not sink to their level, especially a democratic one.

          Nothing will make it easier for Hamas to find new recruits than large numbers of people in Gaza who are grieving their lost ones: and so the cycle of violence continues.

        • gmtom@lemmy.world
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          1 year ago

          don’t give a shut anymore, I don’t give a shit where the gazan will go, I don’t give a shit if they don’t have food

          And much of the world does not give a shit about you or any other Israeli either. You guys have murdered far far far far far more Palestinians, innocent palestinians at that, then hamas has killed Israelis. And thats exactly why these attacks happened, thats exactly why your freinds have lost their families and been taken hostage. You yourself and every other person in Israel are to blame for this and supported this. If you want the blood to flow start with your own

        • nednobbins@lemm.ee
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          1 year ago

          Didn’t the IDF already kill the 1,500 or so terrorists who did this?

          What reason do we have to believe that the thousands of people who are currently getting bombed had anything to do with this at all, beyond having the misfortune of living in Gaza?

          • Ð Greıt Þu̇mpkin@lemm.ee
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            1 year ago

            The fact that hostages are in Gaza, so obviously a significant number of the raiders were able to make it back with those poor folks in tow

            • nednobbins@lemm.ee
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              1 year ago

              The current estimates are between 100 and 150 hostages. A single armed person can transport several unarmed hostages. They’ll be tied up and consist mostly of people who don’t put up much resistance (since those people tend to get killed rather than taken hostage).

              Even if we’re generous and assume one guard per hostage, that’s at most 150 terrorists that made it back to Gaza.

          • Senuf@lemmy.ml
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            1 year ago

            Just answering to the first question: As of today, according to Israeli media, that number is quite off.

            • nednobbins@lemm.ee
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              1 year ago

              I haven’t been able to find new numbers today. A bunch of articles restating the number of Israelis killed by Hamas and a few talking about estimates for numbers killed in Gaza but I haven’t found updated info on how many of the Hamas terrorists died in Israel.

    • nednobbins@lemm.ee
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      1 year ago

      The reports I’ve read claim that around 1,000 Hamas terrorist entered Israel. The IDF claims to have recovered the bodies of about 1,500 terrorists inside Israel. Given that this is an active conflict, it’s not surprising that the numbers don’t line up but they’re of the same order of magnitude.

      Since Hamas has hostages it’s clear that at least some of those terrorists made it back to Gaza. It’s also clear that the IDF has, by now, killed the vast majority of the terrorists who carried out these acts.

      So who is currently being targeted by IDF ordinance?

      • Ð Greıt Þu̇mpkin@lemm.ee
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        1 year ago

        My guess is the operation being carried out is to close the border with Egypt to establish full access control in and out of Gaza. Any other ops being carried out will either be hostage rescue, targeted attempts at black bagging participants and leaders of the attacks, or causing general mayhem to keep Hamas from being able to coordinate with itself for long enough to mount a counteroperation.

        The end goal will be twofold, 1) gain customs control over all points of entry to the strip to neuter Hamas’ ability to keep importing rockets and the parts to make their own, 2) sweep the strip for the leaders of the attack for as public and humiliating a comupence as can be legally dropped on them, and probably beyond that too. This attack put a serious black eye on Israel’s hawks claiming they’re the faction for tighter security that will keep the Israeli people safe, Bibi is probably seeing enough red that it’s a sign of officials intervening against his worst reflexes that we’re not witnessing a Srebenica scenario in Gaza right now.

        • nednobbins@lemm.ee
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          1 year ago

          They may move to tactics like that eventually but for now it’s artillery and airstrikes. Netanyahu threatened to bomb Gaza to rubble and it looks like he’s carrying that out.

          I don’t see anything targeted about the current retaliation; what we’re hearing and seeing now is most consistent with a scorched earth policy.

    • kent_eh@lemmy.ca
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      1 year ago

      Hopefully the regular Palestinians survive with out much damage.

      Based on the last 50+ years of history of conflict between these 2, I can’t be optimistic that your hopes will come true.